[Dixonary] OT

I just found a word which I shall never play so I offer it to a lively
EfremÂ* - *efremovite *- I found it paired with /grammatite/

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Thank you, John!

However, since it was named for geologist Ivan Antonovich Yefremov, shouldn't it be Yefremovite? I suppose it depends on one's preference in transliterating Cyrillic.

(Y)efrem

======================

> On Oct 3, 2020, at 1:37 PM, Johnb - co.uk <johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk> wrote:
>
> I just found a word which I shall never play so I offer it to a lively Efrem - efremovite - I found it paired with grammatite
>
> --
> JohnnyB
>
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How cool!

On Sat, Oct 3, 2020, 1:43 PM Efrem G Mallach <efrem.mallach (AT) gmail (DOT) com>
wrote:

> Thank you, John!
>
> However, since it was named for geologist Ivan Antonovich Yefremov,
> shouldn't it be Yefremovite? I suppose it depends on one's preference in
> transliterating Cyrillic.
>
> (Y)efrem
>
> ======================
>
> On Oct 3, 2020, at 1:37 PM, Johnb - co.uk <johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk> wrote:
>
> I just found a word which I shall never play so I offer it to a lively
> Efrem - *efremovite *- I found it paired with *grammatite*
> --
> *JohnnyB*
>
>
> <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_cam paign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> Virus-free.
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can anyone see who the last vote is from (without taking action to reply
to it)
--
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Judy,Â* it was the one before that that voted for 5 and 7

*JohnyB*
On 05/01/2021 16:51, Judy Madnick wrote:
> If it was Dan Widdis, yes, his name appears as the sender in my
> third-party email program.
> Judy
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Original Message
> From: "Johnb - co.uk" <johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk>
> To: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com;
> Date: 1/5/2021 11:46:42 AM
> Subject: [Dixonary] OT
>
> can anyone see who the last vote is from (without taking action to
> reply to it)
> --
> *JohnnyB*
>
> <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_cam paign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>
> Virus-free. www.avg.com
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That was Mike Shefler.

Alan



From: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> On Behalf Of Johnb - co.uk
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2021 12:00 PM
To: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
Subject: Re: [Dixonary] OT



Judy, it was the one before that that voted for 5 and 7

JohnyB

On 05/01/2021 16:51, Judy Madnick wrote:

If it was Dan Widdis, yes, his name appears as the sender in my third-party email program.



Judy



_____

Original Message

From: "Johnb - co.uk" <mailto:johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk> <johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co..uk>

To: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com <mailto:dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> ;

Date: 1/5/2021 11:46:42 AM

Subject: [Dixonary] OT



can anyone see who the last vote is from (without taking action to reply to it)

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I voted for 5 and 7.

--Mike



On 1/5/2021 12:03 PM, amallach (AT) comcast (DOT) net wrote:


@font-face {font-family:"Cambria Math"; panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}@font-face {font-family:Calibri; panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}@font-face {font-family:Verdana; panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {margin:0in; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}a:link, span.MsoHyperlink {mso-style-priority:99; color:blue; text-decoration:underline;}span.EmailStyle19 {mso-style-typeersonal-reply; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:windowtext;}.MsoChpDefault {mso-style-type:export-only; font-size:10.0pt;}div.WordSection1 {page:WordSection1;}



That was Mike Shefler.



Alan



Â*







From: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com &lt;dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com&gt; On Behalf Of Johnb - co.uk
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2021 12:00 PM
To: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
Subject: Re: [Dixonary] OT







Â*



Judy,Â* it was the one before that that voted for 5 and 7





JohnyB







On 05/01/2021 16:51, Judy Madnick wrote:







If it was Dan Widdis, yes, his name appears as the sender in my third-party email program.







Â*







Judy







Â*













Original Message







From: "Johnb - co.uk" &lt;johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk&gt;







To: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com;







Date: 1/5/2021 11:46:42 AM







Subject: [Dixonary] OT







Â*





can anyone see who the last vote is from (without taking action to reply to it)





--
JohnnyB







Â*







Virus-free. www.avg.com







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Â*



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Alan ,
I know it was Mike ... but what did your email show?

My problem is that anyone who sends from Dixonary group appears to me
only as from Dixonary --- I have to begin a process of forwarding to see
who it was sent byÂ* - just a PIA in the voting phase but also the source
of unwanted crowns it the definition phase

Â*I was just wondering what anyone else sees

--------------------------
[If I go to the group then his email appears (with the single quote
marks) as


'France International/Mike Shefler' via Dixonary

so the group knows it is different to other people whom just appear as
names, I just wish it would show that on the email and not merely and
only the sender as Dixonary

*JohnnyB*
On 05/01/2021 17:03, amallach (AT) comcast (DOT) net wrote:
>
> That was Mike Shefler.
>
> Alan
>
> *From:* dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> *On
> Behalf Of *Johnb - co.uk
> *Sent:* Tuesday, January 5, 2021 12:00 PM
> *To:* dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
> *Subject:* Re: [Dixonary] OT
>
> Judy,Â* it was the one before that that voted for 5 and 7
>
> *JohnyB*
>
> On 05/01/2021 16:51, Judy Madnick wrote:
>
> If it was Dan Widdis, yes, his name appears as the sender in my
> third-party email program.
>
> Judy
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Original Message
>
> From: "Johnb - co.uk" <johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk>
> <mailto:johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk>
>
> To: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com <mailto:dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com>;
>
> Date: 1/5/2021 11:46:42 AM
>
> Subject: [Dixonary] OT
>
> can anyone see who the last vote is from (without taking action to
> reply to it)
>
> --
> *JohnnyB*
>
> Image removed by sender.
> <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_cam paign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>
>
>
>
> Virus-free. www.avg.com
> <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_cam paign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>
>
>
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Thanks Alan - so outlook can handle it
*JohnnyB*
On 05/01/2021 17:44, amallach (AT) comcast (DOT) net wrote:
>
> Johnny – here’s a screenshot of Mike’s message and my inbox.
>
> Alan
>


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So can the Gmail app on my phone, and my desk top email client The Bat!

On Tue, 5 Jan 2021, 18:52 Johnb - co.uk, <johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

> Thanks Alan - so outlook can handle it
> *JohnnyB*
>
>

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With no conviction that either is remotely plausible, I’ll go with 5 and 8.

Alan





From: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> On Behalf Of Johnb - co.uk
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2021 12:20 PM
To: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com
Subject: Re: [Dixonary] OT



Alan ,
I know it was Mike ... but what did your email show?

My problem is that anyone who sends from Dixonary group appears to me only as from Dixonary --- I have to begin a process of forwarding to see who it was sent by - just a PIA in the voting phase but also the source of unwanted crowns it the definition phase

I was just wondering what anyone else sees

--------------------------
[If I go to the group then his email appears (with the single quote marks) as


'France International/Mike Shefler' via Dixonary


so the group knows it is different to other people whom just appear as names, I just wish it would show that on the email and not merely and only the sender as Dixonary

JohnnyB

On 05/01/2021 17:03, amallach (AT) comcast (DOT) net <mailto:amallach (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

That was Mike Shefler.

Alan



From: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com <mailto:dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> <mailto:dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> On Behalf Of Johnb - co.uk
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2021 12:00 PM
To: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com <mailto:dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com>
Subject: Re: [Dixonary] OT



Judy, it was the one before that that voted for 5 and 7

JohnyB

On 05/01/2021 16:51, Judy Madnick wrote:

If it was Dan Widdis, yes, his name appears as the sender in my third-party email program.



Judy



_____

Original Message

From: "Johnb - co.uk" <mailto:johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk> <johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co..uk>

To: dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com <mailto:dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> ;

Date: 1/5/2021 11:46:42 AM

Subject: [Dixonary] OT



can anyone see who the last vote is from (without taking action to reply to it)

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> My problem is that anyone who sends from Dixonary group appears to me only as from Dixonary --- I
> have to begin a process of forwarding to see who it was sent byÂ* - just a PIA in the voting phase
> but also the source of unwanted crowns it the definition phase
>
> Â*I was just wondering what anyone else sees

Thunderbird shows the sender as
'France International/Mike Shefler' via Dixonary <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com>

but if I ask to see the full message headers, there are further clues there:

ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@salsgiver.com
header.s=default header.b=btKJOwqR; spf=pass (google.com: domain of stamps (AT) salsgiver (DOT) com designates
206.67.234.106 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=stamps (AT) salsgiver (DOT) com; dmarc=pass (p=REJECT sp=NONE
dis=NONE) header.from=salsgiver.com

and there are a couple of Received lines that also mention the real sender address.

Best wishes,
Tim.

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Tim

Ah, it must be a setting in ThunderbirdÂ* mine only shows 'from Dixionary"

the interesting thing in my mind is that for decades a single quotation
mark has been the initiation of a REM or comment and therefore the
remainder is to be ignored... In that sense TB is correct it is ignoring
what is after the '

OK, so the next question is why is it that Mike and Efrem are recorded
in the group with a commentÂ* (and apparently no-one else is)--- I'll ask Dan

*JohnnyB*
On 06/01/2021 10:32, Tim B wrote:
>> My problem is that anyone who sends from Dixonary group appears to me
>> only as from Dixonary --- I have to begin a process of forwarding to
>> see who it was sent byÂ* - just a PIA in the voting phase but also the
>> source of unwanted crowns it the definition phase
>>
>> Â*Â*I was just wondering what anyone else sees
>
> Thunderbird shows the sender as
> 'France International/Mike Shefler' via Dixonary
> <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com>
>
> but if I ask to see the full message headers, there are further clues
> there:
>
> ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass (test
> mode) header.i=@salsgiver.com header.s=default header.b=btKJOwqR;
> spf=pass (google.com: domain of stamps (AT) salsgiver (DOT) com designates
> 206.67.234.106 as permitted sender)
> smtp.mailfrom=stamps (AT) salsgiver (DOT) com; dmarc=pass (p=REJECT sp=NONE
> dis=NONE) header.from=salsgiver.com
>
> and there are a couple of Received lines that also mention the real
> sender address.
>
> Best wishes,
> Tim.
>



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A single quote is not a comment in an email header. RFC 2822 says it is
permitted in an address, at para 3.4.1.

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Dan,
Thank you very much - I understand<sigh>

the information is there in the header so I am working on the switches
in my email client automatically to show it all -- then I will have to
find out what happens to 'reply' and 'reply list'

*JohnnyB*
On 07/01/2021 06:54, Daniel B Widdis wrote:
>
> * OK, so the next question is why is it that Mike and Efrem are
> recorded in the group with a commentÂ* (and apparently no-one else
> is)--- I'll ask Dan
>
> Short answer:Â* Mike and Efrem send from email domains which are not
> authenticated by their SMTP servers, Google doesn’t think they’re
> trustworthy, and alters the From: header to protect us, and there’s
> nothing we can do to change that behavior.
>
> Longer answer: Â*In reaction to the flood of email spam (55% of all
> email is spam, down from a peak of 69% in 2012), a system called DKIM
> (Domain Keys Identified Mail) was developed to add an authentication
> message to a header verifying that the user sending the email was an
> authorized user of that registered domain. By comparing the header
> with information in the domain’s DNS record, we know that, for
> example, an email sent from dixonary.net came from someone logged in
> and authenticated at dixonary.net, and is unchanged since it was sent.
> Â*Â*More than you probably want to know about it is explained at this
> site: https://postmarkapp.com/guides/dkim
> <https://postmarkapp.com/guides/dkim>
>
> Many spam detection algorithms use this header (or the lack of it) as
> part of determining a spam score for an email.Â* Without the header, we
> don’t know if:
>
> * Some devious person named Dan is writing an email to the group
> pretending to be Mike, voting for his own definition!
> * Some really super devious person (also named Dan) controls a
> routing switch on the internet, and is intercepting Mike’s
> original email somewhere in the middle of the internet and
> changing his votes before they arrive at the group!
>
> A few years ago, Google decided not to display the return email
> address of emails sent to the group which failed DKIM authentication.Â*
> The net effect of this is that by the time the email is delivered to
> all the players, the group’s email address has been substituted for
> their own. Basically, the “From:� header has been changed..
>
> Original header:
>
> From: "Mike Shefler" <stamps (AT) salsgiver (DOT) com>
>
> Google-altered header:
>
> From: "'Mike Shefler' via Dixonary" <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com>
>
> * Note addition of single quotes around Mike’s name and addition of
> “via Dixonary� leading to the behavior you describe below
> * Note the email address is changed, hampering the ability to reply
>
> Most email clients understand this new format and still display Mike’s
> name, even though the email address has been removed so replying is
> difficult.Â* Sometimes, however, an email client may associate the
> email address (the group) with an address book entry that already
> exists (the group) and just show you whatever name you’ve assigned
> that entry in your address book, regardless of the name actually entered.
>
> Bottom line:Â* There’s nothing we, the recipients can do, other than
> shake an angry fist at Google. The solution to avoid Google altering
> the From: header is for Mike and Efrem to use an SMTP server that
> authenticates them at their email domains.
>
> * One option is to send to the group from a separate email address
> that authenticates them, like gmail.com or dixonary.net.
> * Efrem has posted most of his recent messages from a gmail.com
> address, but the round 3124 results message came from his
> Verizon.net email address. But he sent It via a yahoo.com SMTP
> server, resulting in the above behavior.Â* I believe he could
> probably fix this behavior by changing his client’s SMTP setting
> from “smtp.yahoo.com� to “smtp.verizon.net�.
> * Mike uses some other custom mailserver setup for his salsgiver.com
> address, and I have no idea how to unravel that.Â* Google still
> doesn’t like it.
>
> And given the formatting of the altered emails, you can probably
> conclude if you can’t see the sender that it’s either Mike or Efrem.Â*
> Efrem usually signs his name to his emails. So if you really don’t
> know, guess Mike.Â* If you’re wrong, then Mike will fix it up as
> scorekeeper.
>
> Dan
>
> *From: *Dixonary <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> on behalf of "Johnb -
> co.uk" <johnb (AT) john-barrs (DOT) co.uk>
> *Reply-To: *Dixonary <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com>
> *Date: *Wednesday, January 6, 2021 at 3:14 AM
> *To: *Tim B <dixonary (AT) siam (DOT) co.uk>, Dixonary <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com>
> *Subject: *Re: [Dixonary] OT
>
> Tim
>
> Ah, it must be a setting in ThunderbirdÂ* mine only shows 'from Dixionary"
>
> the interesting thing in my mind is that for decades a single
> quotation mark has been the initiation of a REM or comment and
> therefore the remainder is to be ignored... In that sense TB is
> correct it is ignoring what is after the '
>
> OK, so the next question is why is it that Mike and Efrem are recorded
> in the group with a commentÂ* (and apparently no-one else is)--- I'll
> ask Dan
>
> *JohnnyB*
>
> On 06/01/2021 10:32, Tim B wrote:
>
> My problem is that anyone who sends from Dixonary group
> appears to me only as from Dixonary --- I have to begin a
> process of forwarding to see who it was sent byÂ* - just a PIA
> in the voting phase but also the source of unwanted crowns it
> the definition phase
>
> Â*Â*I was just wondering what anyone else sees
>
>
> Thunderbird shows the sender as
> 'France International/Mike Shefler' via Dixonary
> <dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com> <mailto:dixonary (AT) googlegroups (DOT) com>
>
> but if I ask to see the full message headers, there are further
> clues there:
>
> ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass
> (test mode) header.i=@salsgiver.com
> <mailto:header.i=@salsgiver.com> header.s=default
> header.b=btKJOwqR; spf=pass (google.com: domain of
> stamps (AT) salsgiver (DOT) com <mailto:stamps (AT) salsgiver (DOT) com> designates
> 206.67.234.106 as permitted sender)
> smtp.mailfrom=stamps (AT) salsgiver (DOT) com
> <mailto:smtp.mailfrom=stamps (AT) salsgiver (DOT) com>; dmarc=pass (p=REJECT
> sp=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=salsgiver.com
>
> and there are a couple of Received lines that also mention the
> real sender address.
>
> Best wishes,
> Tim.
>
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> This devious person is not going to change his email domain.

I can't remember the details, but there is a way to indicate that emails from a domain may
legitimately come from a different mail server. I had to do this some time ago to avoid a particular
mail server refusing my emails.

Best wishes,
Tim Bourne.

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